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Omar Epps Interview PDF Print E-mail
Written by The Diva   
Sunday, 09 July 2006

The Diva's interview with
Omar Epps
Star of
Against The Ropes (2004)

The Diva's Against the Ropes Movie review

Copyright Kamal Larsuel, 2004


The Discussion

Do I tell him that I've never interviewed a celebrity before? Is my bra strap showing? Do I have food in my teeth? Does my breath stink? What if he is mad at me over my Dracula 2000 review? What if I ask the wrong question and offend him? Lord, I have to pee again. I can't pee with him in the room next door. What if he has an entourage and they clown me? What if he is in a bad mood and rude? All those thoughts ran through my head in the 15 seconds it took for me to walk through the door and up to Omar Epps. The minute he looked me straight in my eyes, turned on that megawatt smile and firmly shook my hand, I knew it would be okay.

Standing before me in Jeans, a burgundy sweater and burgundy high tops was Omar Epps. It was as if he knew I had never done this before and gave me a piercing look that said, "It's okay, you can do this." I took his cue put my fears aside. To my untrained eye, it looked as though he was just as happy to see me, as I him. Seattle doesn't have the biggest black population in the world and I'm pretty certain I was probably the first and only black person to interview him that day.

The ice was broken by the fact that he was eating a quick breakfast of steak and eggs. Quick because they served him what amounted to two little steak balls. We joked about that and instantly connected. We talked about everything from boxing to community responsibility and before I knew it, we had spoken for an hour. 15 minutes longer than we were supposed to.


The Diva:
I saw Against the Ropes while I was on vacation and I enjoyed it, I thought it was cute. What made you choose that role?

Omar:
Well the first thing was, selfishly what made me choose the role was that the first time I read the script , the character didn't have a chip on his shoulder. He didn't have the whole blame the world for his circumstances thing. And that was refreshing. That little glimmer of light right was really it for me. The chance to work with Charles again and a chance to work with Meg Ryan. And I really dug the story. I knew about Jackie Kallen's boxer, but I certainly didn't know they were managed by her.


The Diva:
I had never heard of her which surprised me because I really am pretty much into the sports world - well I don't really care for boxing. I never really have -


Omar:
You don't like boxing? I love boxing!


The Diva:
You know what I used to kinda of like it, but when I was a kid, I was watching Sugar Ray Leonard and he was doing this wind up popeye thing and he actually hit the guy and I said, "Okay this is rigged."


Omar:
Nah


The Diva:
Everybody who has ever watched Popeye, knows that when you wind up - you getting ready to get hit!


Omar:
He had the Bolo punch.


The Diva:
Why is it called the Bolo Punch?


Omar:
Because that's what he would do. He would wind up - but he would hit you with either hand. That's what was funny. He wind up and the guy would lean in and he would jab him or hit him with a punch, but he was just showing off though.


The Diva:
Yeah but I'm like you see him winding up so you know you gettin' ready to get hit. I'm like - "DUCK!" And after that I was like forget about it.


Omar:
The same thing with Ali. Most of his fights, the dude is standing in front of you dancing and talking to somebody else. Cuz' see when you are in the square circle it's a whole different ball game. There's nowhere to go, there's nowhere to run. And when you see that in boxing, the guy who is doing that - knows. Both of the guys know that they guy who is doing that is whuppin' the other guys ass. That's just showmanship and I think they were doing that to make boxing entertaining.


The Diva:
And then there was the famous 90 second Tyson bout -


Omar:
That's fear.


The Diva:
It was on pay per view. My uncle ordered. He was charging $2 at the door to cover the food.


Omar:
[laughter] right. right.


The Diva:
So the whole neighborhood was coming over. My mother got like one piece of fried chicken on one plate and the fight was over!


Omar:
That's fear. That's ill that you would bring up that fight because, that one fight from that fear can really defeat you. So that's all that was. It wasn't even a fight. It was just a man who was deathly scared of the other man, so he was like whatever I get hit with, I don't want it. And he just went down.


The Diva:
Is that something that you carry with you in term of your career? No fear?


Omar:
Yes. You gotta have no fear. The only thing that I fear is the power of God. Like I tell the church going folks; they say you need be a God fearing Christian and I tell them that God has never given me anything to fear him. [laughter] But I can respect that, but yeah fear can defeat you. Because if you have fear - it's kind of like the character of Luther Shaw. He has fear, so that is why he is in his circumstances. That’s why he is not getting off his ass and doing anything and he needs that push and that's what Meg's character Jackie Kallen does. She comes in with a fearless quality and they take this journey. Cause in life, yeah if you fear, you'll succumb to that, you'll be in a prison forever, because if you fear one thing - it's contagious - you'll fear other things and before you know it, you'll be wearing a mask and gloves. So yeah, it's something that I carry with me in life.


The Diva:
Based on that, how do you choose your roles?


Omar:
It's different. When I read a film, the first thing I do is read the whole thing like a book. What does that say? How does that resonate? And if it resonates, I read it again and just from that particular character’s point of view. And then it's about the challenge. Is it challenging to me. Is it something I can do? Are there things that I have or can come up with that bring something from the character that us not on the paper? The other characters and the other actors that are involved. Who the director is going to be - that's important because the director is very important because they are like the shepherd to the sheep. And that's where I really choose it from. Now that I have a young tenure in the business, it's strategic in terms of some of the things I want to do. I want to do a high-end action movie. I want to do a romantic comedy. So there are certain films that I looking for anyway. Then I have to just throw that out of the window and ask is it good or not and at the end of the day, you never know. I mean there was a script that I read and I thought it was one of the best scripts I had ever read in my whole life. And the movie was "Dogma" remember that movie?


The Diva:
Yeah!


Omar:
That script was to this day was one of the most brilliant scripts I've ever read in my whole life.


The Diva:
Kevin Smith is underratedly brilliant


Omar:
He is brilliant! But it was weird to how people responded to it. How it was said to me was weird "Aw it's some crazy thing.” So it's a really objective thing and people have their own opinions about it. It's really hard to put a rating on art. You know ultimately for me it's a selfish thing and it's a selfless thing. What can I get out of it, but what can I bring to it?


The Diva:
Are you worried about any role that sits upon you and makes you responsible for the black community? You know what I mean?


Omar:
[chuckles] You know it's funny. We are some funny people. Black people - we amaze me all the time. It’s like we can't win for losing. We do so many things backwards - for instance: Everybody - okay I'm not saying anything about this person, I'm just using it an example - but everybody felt the same way about O.J., but because he's black we're gonna jump behind him now. You feeling me? Yeah they shouldn't have beat Rodney King's ass - that was really heinous what they did, but he was driving drunk! I have kids in the world, what if he.. god forbid... let's jump behind a winner.


The Diva:
As far as I'm concerned... O.J. is guilty of something. I've always felt that way and it hurt my heart when he was acquitted and the television showed all the white folks basically saying "DAMN" and the black college students cheering. And I've always wondered if they were cheering because they really thought him to be innocent or because a black man got off.


Omar:
You have to understand both sides. Now I don't know if he is guilty, but he knows something about something. We need to get behind a cause that counts. For us to put the onus of black role models on people who are in films is ass backwards, because it's movie - it's entertainment. Now if you are doing a certain type of film - "Malcolm X" or "Do the Right Thang" and that is what the film is about then that's cool. If I were Jewish and doing "Schindler's List" that's what it's about our culture and our people. It's just "Against the Ropes" this film and a lot films I do are just films and even though they may be based on true stories about young black folk. Those stories are for that specific audience and everyone else and for the rest of the world to see how that guy got over himself. Like I did this movie "Conviction" which was a movie about a convicted murderer who found enlightenment through Shakespeare. It opened his world to a whole new world. It wasn't about being a role model. It's hard, but that's what we do. I tell you the "we" don't care and I can't really lose because I'm me and I'm "us". The only thing people don't want me to do is show up with you-know-who on the red carpet.


The Diva:
Right, but that goes back to the responsible - the onus, you know what I mean. God forbid... because then you know you are going to hear it. "He get a little successful and then he went out and got Barbie.".....


Omar:
But people are gonna say what they are gonna say and you can't please everyone. What I've learned is that the best way to teach - if there is anyway to teach is by example. The best way for a young black man or black woman who's out there in their world to be affected by something I do, is for me to walk my walk. For me to live my life. For them to have a broad perspective of it so that it's not just this or that or this, the get to look over a span of time, you know and see the rhythms. The ups and downs and everyone can't be on top forever. It just popped into my mind and is great for this film, but there is a saying, "The mark of a true champion is how he rises from defeat." And that's what it's all about in terms of being a role mode to young black kids. It's how I will raise from whatever defeats in my life I encounter that makes the mark of a champion and their eyes and that's all that really matters anyway.


The Diva:
And speaking of the movie and you-know-who on the red carpet... I had a little bit of "Okay...white savior bringing the brotha out of the ghetto." But then I saw the movie and it's both of them bringing each other up.


Omar:
right it's both of them bringing each other up.


The Diva:
Charles Dutton's character balances them both out. And so I would encourage people to not do what I did and look beyond the impression the trailers give. But you know that's 3BC does try to look at things from a black perspective and so something like that tend to jump out at us. Anyway, what was it like work with Charles and Meg?


Omar:
Charles and I had worked before on "Conviction" and um yeah I was really excited to work with him again.


The Diva:
This was his theatrical directorial debut, right?


Omar:
Right. That was exciting. Meg is a wonderful personality. Really a great spirit and it was exciting because she was in a place in her life and career, I’m sure where she wanted to be challenged. She wanted to do something new and go some place that she had never been. So when you are surrounded by that kind of energy – it’s exciting because of its newness. It’s not the same old walk in the park. And outwardly, Meg and Jackie are two completely different people. You know the real Jackie Kallen is really out spoken. I mean what she did in the boxing world was unheard of. It was incredible because it is a male dominated sport. Make no mistake about it; there are a lot of dark qualities that surround the world of boxing.


The Diva:
And it is so sexist! Half-naked women running around…


Omar:
Right!


Omar:
Right. Excatly! But everything is on Front Street. You know what you’re getting. That’s just the way that it is and there is nothing you can do about it. But Jackie made the boxing world deal with her on her own terms. And she kept her femininity. She wasn’t one of the gals who was trying to be one of the guys. She knew how to work it and she was successful and she had some legendary boxers under her tutelage. And to see Meg transform herself into this bodacious woman everyday was a lot of fun. And of course the boxing stuff was fun because boxing is one of my favorite sports.


The Diva:
So did you have to get in shape? I mean I know there is in shape and then there is in boxing shape.


Omar:
Hopefully I was in boxing shape. I only had a month and a half to get ready. So I went 5 hours a day. Studying tapes and working on technique. Just eating and sleeping boxing. And I wanted to be prepared as I can be because I’m an avid boxing fan and Charles is an avid boxing fan And we wanted to up the ante for boxing on film. We have a great story and a great backdrop but we wanted the boxing to be hellacious. We wanted people to feel like they were watching a pay-per-view fight, so -


The Diva:
And I did feel that way


Omar:
Good. But in order to do that, you can choreograph but so much. And we choreographed a lot, but on the day that you are filming things are going so fast that the camera missed this or it missed that so sometimes we had to just get in there and dice it up.


The Diva:
And you were taking those punches?

Omar:
I took a coupla shots and I gave out some in return. But it was cool. It was all in good fun.


The Diva:
Now you mentioned something earlier that I wanted to go back to. Do you have children?

Omar:
Yeah, I have a little girl.


The Diva:
How old is she?


Omar:
She’s 4 1/2 going on 14,


The Diva:
Yeah, my daughter just had a birthday on 1/18 and she is 1 going on 10


Omar:
You got the two’s to look forward to.


The Diva:
I’m already in the twos!


Omar:
That’s when they get opinionated.


The Diva:
She’s already opinionated without having much of a vocabulary. [laughter] Yeah her word for “No” is biting and hitting -


Omar:
and punching?


The Diva:
Yup


Omar:
Wow. But that’s the easy part. Because when she starts telling you “no” you get offended.


The Diva:
I want her to tell me “No” because I’m tired of getting my ass kicked by an infant.


Omar:
[Laughter] I hear ya.


The Diva:
Anyway I brought up to ask, what is it like being a parent and being your profession and always having to be away? If I’m throwing salt in a wound and you don’t want to talk about it, we can move on.


Omar:
Oh no no it’s cool. We can talk about it. It’s tough. It’s hard but you have to make it work. You have to sacrifice a lot of other things in order for there to be continuity with that. You know she’s 4 ½ so she just now gets. I mean last year she saw me and I was crying and she made sure that I was faking it, but she is just kinda getting the gist of it. I explain to her that I’m and actor and I have to go on business trips. Rather than try to keep her away from it, I try to give her a stable family life. That’s all that matters. As long as there is consistency even if that means that twice a year daddy goes away for three months. Within those 3 months I have to bring her to me or I go back to her – some sort of compromising And it’s going to get harder as she gets older because she is going to start getting her own agenda. She may not want to come out with daddy.


The Diva:
Yeah, she’s going to have basketball or soccer or whatever


Omar:
Exactly. So you just have to balance it out. And hey, we make good money in this business and you gotta use the money to make your family life work.


The Diva:
Is this a business you would discourage her from entering into?


Omar:
If she this is what she felt she wanted to do… I want to encourage my child to do what ever she wants to do. Naturally, you don’t want your child to make the same mistake you’ve made and the other thing I have to think about is with her last name being Epps is that going to be a gift or a curse? Well she have fair opportunity like the next person or will people be all funky towards her or is she going to get special treatment even if she’s not that good.. I would want her to have a fair shake it and if something that she is very passionate about and really wants to do. What am I going do? I gotta get behind her and support her.


The Diva:
right on. Speaking of fair opportunity. … Will Smith once said that the only color Hollywood cares about is green. In reference to -


Omar:
Black Hollywod.

The Diva:
Yeah – and I can agree with that, but my next thought was - are black people in Hollywood given the opportunity or the roles to make the green? That’s what I would ask.


Omar:
That’s a good question. This is what I feel about that whole subject in a nutshell. The world is as it should be. You got make do with what ya got.
What you’re getting at it way more mothafuckin deeper than Hollywood or music.


The Diva:
Okay.


The Diva:
Right. Right. Except for the brotha rule.



Omar:
And that’s what I’m saying. That’s what’s messed up. They do that because they feel bad and they know they are gonna get hit so the feel like they gotta add a brotha in and that’s how the brotha ends up looking like the token dude because that’s what it was made for. They feel that they have to meet their quota And now the Spanish people done made their come up. People of Latin descent – in the last two years they’ve become the new black movement and in another two years it will be the Asian movement.. Every ethnicity is going to have their movement. It’s up to us to create vehicles for ourselves. At the end of the day what Will Smith is saying is true; Hollywood only cares about one color – green. Are we given the opportunity to make green? Yeah. The problem is – black Hollywood, to me – we have squandered those opportunities because we have lowered our level. The standard of just a black movie is BULLSHIT. Spike Lee didn’t go to film school and be the fucking genius that he is for every Tom, Dick, Joe, and Harry to get a high-8 and think they can make a movie. Now that you have that type of world- I’m not going to name any names, but I will say that the standard of our films has descended. And therein lies the problem so we get treated like that. When you coming in and saying “Oh all I need is 2 or 3 million dollars…” that’s all you gonna get. But if you coming in asking for 30-40-50 million, your shit gotta be up to par and it’s gotta be standard because I gotta know… I mean if I wanted to invested that kind of money in somebody it’s gotta be hot so I can make my money back otherwise what’s the point? Of taking the shot? You know? And as far as us.. we gotta stop complaining and take the onus unto ourselves. We have to make our own – we have to put ourselves into a position that we’re indispensable. Which we are doing everywhere. We have to wake up and smell the coffee and I really feel that even in Hollywood we gotta open p our eyes and realize the effects that all the hundreds of millions of dollars that all the black athletes are making and all the actors and entertainers and rappers are gonna have kids. And their kids are gonna have kids so we need to start seeing it like that – Dang we have a whole generation of kids have gone to the best schools and have the best clothes and best the everything. Now what? Are we going to turn into the snobby ones that live in The Hamptons? That we turn our noses up to like “Rich Kids” on HBO? Did you see that special?

The Diva:
Yeah I saw it.


Omar:
Are we going to turn into that? So my whole thing is that we have enough money to build our own Martha’s Vineyard. Our own Hamptons. Why are we still trying to fit in somewhere? Why not just make ourselves indispensable and make what do indispensable? And you see that starting to happen in athletics, first of all. They’ve made themselves indispensable so you have to hire Isiah Thomas? They have to start giving these people higher level jobs – the higher echelon of those corporations. It’s happening in music. They have to give Jay Z, Zane (The Diva: Or Dane, I’m not sure who he said), and Puff millions of dollars to make records because they are indispensable now and they are making their money with or without you. And black film – we’re like the last of the Mohicans. We have yet to do that. We have yet to make ourselves a [cohesive] group. We have yet to group ourselves. We are the only culture… you know everyone else comes to this country and capitalizes off of what we built basically. And still ain’t got it together or put our heads together and still try to do something for us. You know? And therein lies the problem.

The Diva:
It reminds me of American Zoetrope. Francis Ford Coppola, George Lucas, and a few others founded that production company in the 70s because they weren’t getting any respect out of the studios so the pooled together the money and did. Now ultimately it failed, but it seems like… you know why can’t black Hollywood do that.


NOTE: A.Z. did not fail. I have no idea where I got that from. I was watching Jeepers Creepers 2 and imagine my surprise to see that it was an A.Z film. I coulda sworn I heard that it failed while watching the Biography Channel special on George Lucas. But it doesn’t diminish that point we were trying to make. END NOTE


Omar:
Ultimately it failed. But name those people once more – Francis Ford Coppola, George Lucas and Steven Spielberg.

The Diva:
I don’t remember if Steven Spielberg was involved in it.


Omar:
He was the young dude in the group. I’m saying that to say this; Steven Speilberg has his own studio. Every time you watch a movie and you see THX. That’s George Lucas’ company he invented the software and he is getting paid. All this Pixar stuff – that’s all Spielberg money.


The Diva:
Now, given your druthers and you were given the opportunity.. You know if Paramount came to you and said why don’t you get a group of black olks together and start a production company. Would you be up for that?


Omar:
Yeah I’d be up for it, why not? We start a production company. We can start our own studio because we have enough.. It’s about getting together it’s about – for instance Denzel coming together with Wesley; coming together with Will; coming together with Eddie Murphy; coming together with Chris Tucker and Martin Lawrence and I can name probably 3 others that make over $15 million per picture front end – back end they might see another 30 or 40.


The Diva:
Right they see a percentage.


Omar:
Get together. Or for the athletes. Where are the Michael Jordan’s of the world getting together with the young Kobe’s? - “Look I got 500 million. You got 80 million why don’t we get this together?” Because all we gotta do is go to the Middle East and get some of their money. All they want to do is spend money why not get them to help finance some of this stuff.


The Diva:
Have you thought about spearheading this?


Omar:
Nah, because I’m just trying to get where I gotta go. You know what I’m saying? It’s not my fight. My fight is to -


The Diva:
But wouldn’t you benefit from it?


Omar:
Yeah and if I was in that position to really make something come to fruition and I really felt that it was getting somewhere…. Like back in the day when Jim Brown tried to create a union for the Black athletes – that’s what I’m talking about. That’s how you make yourself indispensable. He had Lew Alcindor –That‘s –Kareem- Abdul-Jabaar. He had all of the great athletes from different sports and they tried to get together – like you said about the Coppola thing – it failed, but at least it was a shot. When was the last time we’ve done that? We haven’t. So at the end of the day that what we gotta do. Picture that. What if there was a studio that concentrated on black films and then every now and again they made a mainstream picture? See we don’t have a home. Everybody else got a home. If I was Jewish; I’d have homes all over the world. I could go to any studio.


The Diva:
For real. You could go to DreamWorks.


Omar:
There are Asian Studios there are Latin Studios. Jennifer Lopez just did something big with Telemundo. We never really think that far ahead. I think it is because we’ve never really had anything and we are just reveling in that. Like Oprah. It took her so long to get where she’s at, she’s like “Mine!” You know what I mean?


The Diva:
Right, but that goes back to responsibility to the community. One of the complaints that I have – I do not like the Scary Movie genre (I meant franchise). I think they are vile and disgusting. BUT that first one dropped and it made over 100 million dollars. Props to every black person involved because they broke ground and made history. What I would have like – and who am I to tell someone what to do with their money – but what I would have liked is – Okay so they made some green so now the studios are listening. Why not make Scary Movie 3-4-5 and then make an Eve’s Bayou? Be responsible about it.


Omar:
You know why? Because no one wants to see an Eve’s Bayou from them. And that’s just how it is. You would be surprised at how hard it is for the Wayan Clan to get a movie after Scary Movie because the studio look at like an anomaly – “OH who knew? It broke records!” Now Keenen Wayan directed the highest grossing film by a black director in the history of film…


The Diva:
Ever.


Omar:

They had the highest opening for a comedy – red, black, yellow brown, green whatever -


The Diva:
Ever.


Omar:
They broke records, but Hollywood wasn’t looking at them like there was any pressure. And at us. If they made an Eve’s Bayou people wouldn’t accept that. Unless they made it in a silent way. It comes out and then later we find out that they financed it.


The Diva:
Right I understand and that’s what I was getting at. I realize that the public is not ready for the Wayans’ in much of a dramatic role like an Eve’s Bayou although Requiem for a Dream Awesome. Awesome. Awesome.


Omar:
Of Course.


The Diva:
But it also goes back to our responsibility as consumers. 3BC has been saying from the beginning that we want more substance in our movies. We want another Eve’s Bayou but the public wants to see, no offense, another Booty Call


Omar:
Exactly


The Diva:
You know. {sigh} It’s hard being a black person! We can’t win for losing. I want there to be more responsible movies out there by and for black people. But we’re not going to see them it boils down to the green again.


Omar:
Plus the other thing is no one plans for the day after. Take this for a metaphor – Robbing a bank. All the great robberies were great because all of the robberies were just going through the motions. It was the weeks after the robbery that they planned. Meticulously – how not to get caught. Most people, and I would say 99.9% of all bank robberies fail because all they think about I getting the money and when they got the money and they running out the bank, they didn’t think about helicopters and the cops. This one that one. Undercover cops blah blah blah, They’re not thinking about that. They are just thinking about square one. And so I use that metaphor for this conversation because we don’t think about “we” down the line, we stuck with right here, which is why aren’t these types of movies being made? Well O.K. What if there were these types of movies? What if everything that we wanted was available? Then what? Now let’s make a plan. And hen we make that plan now, we’ll get there. You know? Right now we’re all just one dimensional. We’re just worried about that next step instead of 5 steps ahead. I’m that to say, like when you step, you know how to walk, your foot is going to step whether you know where you are stepping or not. It’s going to keep moving. We’re going to keep evolving. These things will keep happening. More records will be broken. More surprises will be in store and this sort of thing. But what are we really getting? What are we planning for? Are we putting something together this is going to be something monumental one day? And I know a lot of film maker aspire to do that, but set the whole color thing aside, make no qualms about it, this is a tough ass business. To be a film star or be n the movie business ain’t easy no matter what color you are. So if you take that out of the equation, it’s hard enough to just be available to be a working person in this industry. I say that selfishly because by the time you get to work and you do get some sort of consistency, the last thing from your mind is all of that other mess. That’s all mess now, because you can pay bills. I got a steady income. No too much turbulence, I think I can handle this. You don’t want throw black paint all over the whole thing. It’s tough, but I love it. I wouldn’t have it any other way. For me, the best way I can show is by example. And also to inspire. Hopefully, something I do in my work or maybe someone who reads this interview is the next genius and something we’ve said today sparks it all.


The Diva:
Well you are inspirational. In my top 10 for 2000 was Love & Basketball that movie spoke to me on so many levels. Sometimes your character more than Sanaa Lathan’s character because of the family dynamic. I grew up with a ‘sometimey” father. And the obstacles your character faced after nearly achieving his dream, yet being okay with that. That was inspirational to me. So you are doing what you set out to accomplish.


Omar:
Slowly but surely, it’s a great conversation really, because it exists. Its real, but at the same time it what it is. And that all comes from ambition. That’s why I love it. We’re all ambitious we wanna get somewhere and we wanna do this stuff. Let’s stop talking about it and do it. I’ve said some things in the past and I talk about it now. Everything is the way that is should be. I talk to young kids about getting into the game. They asking about acting and the industry and I tell them , “Look this thing is going to be the way that it is. It’s on you traditions and how much of yourself are you willing to give or not give to get where you want to go. And that’s what it’s really all about.


The Diva:
Absolutely. Well I think our time is up now, and I appreciate the conversation.


Omar:
No Doubt. It was a pleasure meeting you. And the website is 3 black girls…?

The Diva:
[laugh] 3blackchicks.com. Stop by and post on the board. We’d love to hear from you.


-----------------------------------

Omar was awesome and I look forward to speaking with him again. I forgot to take a picture of him, so I had to run back upstairs and get a shot, but he was on the phone doing business. But I told him that I didn’t are if he didn’t. So it’s very candid.

My apologies if the interview is a little hard to follow. He and I were very comfortable with one another so we just let it flow – slang; poor grammar and all.

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